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	<title>Comments on: Himachal to contest London auction of rare George Cross Medal</title>
	<atom:link href="http://himachal.us/2009/11/28/himachal-to-contest-london-auction-of-rare-george-cross-medal/17390/news/ravinder/feed" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://himachal.us/2009/11/28/himachal-to-contest-london-auction-of-rare-george-cross-medal/17390/news/ravinder</link>
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		<title>By: Ravinder Makhaik</title>
		<link>http://himachal.us/2009/11/28/himachal-to-contest-london-auction-of-rare-george-cross-medal/17390/news/ravinder/comment-page-1#comment-610398</link>
		<dc:creator>Ravinder Makhaik</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 29 Nov 2009 13:12:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://himachal.us/?p=17390#comment-610398</guid>
		<description>&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.dnw.co.uk/medals/company/latestnews.lasso?story=312&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Dix Noonan Webb Responds&lt;/a&gt;:-

There has been some speculation in the Indian press that these medals were reported stolen in 2002.

As stated from the outset in our catalogue description, which is available &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.dnw.co.uk/medals/company/latestnews.lasso?story=312&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;here&lt;/a&gt;, included with the medals is a sworn affidavit by the widow of Naik Kirpa Ram, Smt Brami Devi, relinquishing ownership of the George Cross and other medals to another party. It can be seen that this affidavit, which bears her fingerprints, is dated April 2000, some two years before the report of the theft.

We take very seriously any claims in respect of stolen property and as is usual in cases like this we are making strenuous investigations to clarify rightful ownership of the property prior to any sale taking place.

Nimrod Dix
Managing Director
Dix Noonan Webb</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://www.dnw.co.uk/medals/company/latestnews.lasso?story=312" rel="nofollow">Dix Noonan Webb Responds</a>:-</p>
<p>There has been some speculation in the Indian press that these medals were reported stolen in 2002.</p>
<p>As stated from the outset in our catalogue description, which is available <a href="http://www.dnw.co.uk/medals/company/latestnews.lasso?story=312" rel="nofollow">here</a>, included with the medals is a sworn affidavit by the widow of Naik Kirpa Ram, Smt Brami Devi, relinquishing ownership of the George Cross and other medals to another party. It can be seen that this affidavit, which bears her fingerprints, is dated April 2000, some two years before the report of the theft.</p>
<p>We take very seriously any claims in respect of stolen property and as is usual in cases like this we are making strenuous investigations to clarify rightful ownership of the property prior to any sale taking place.</p>
<p>Nimrod Dix<br />
Managing Director<br />
Dix Noonan Webb</p>
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		<title>By: Ravinder Makhaik</title>
		<link>http://himachal.us/2009/11/28/himachal-to-contest-london-auction-of-rare-george-cross-medal/17390/news/ravinder/comment-page-1#comment-610395</link>
		<dc:creator>Ravinder Makhaik</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 29 Nov 2009 11:52:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://himachal.us/?p=17390#comment-610395</guid>
		<description>@ Alexander

Just to point out an discrepancy in what you reveal as the history of the George Cross medal ending up for auction in London, the original affidavit which is also put out by the website as a document attesting the authenticity of the medals antecedents clearly mentions that Kirpal Singh received the medal as a gift for services  rendered and nowhere is there any mention of it being sold or purchased. 

Your assumption about &quot;sold her husbands medals to a Kirpal Singh. (Possibly due to financial constraints),&quot; is not substantiated by  facts on record.

The Himachal police inform us that Kirpal Singh has been detained (29.11.2009) and the claims he has made in the original affidavit would be verified - whether Brahmi Devi does at all know him or not.

You also claim that a video about the sale - purchase does exist, let the evidence be brought forth and the investigating agency would be the right people to get to the bottom of the matter.

Ravinder Makhaik
Editor 
My Himachal</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ Alexander</p>
<p>Just to point out an discrepancy in what you reveal as the history of the George Cross medal ending up for auction in London, the original affidavit which is also put out by the website as a document attesting the authenticity of the medals antecedents clearly mentions that Kirpal Singh received the medal as a gift for services  rendered and nowhere is there any mention of it being sold or purchased. </p>
<p>Your assumption about &#8220;sold her husbands medals to a Kirpal Singh. (Possibly due to financial constraints),&#8221; is not substantiated by  facts on record.</p>
<p>The Himachal police inform us that Kirpal Singh has been detained (29.11.2009) and the claims he has made in the original affidavit would be verified &#8211; whether Brahmi Devi does at all know him or not.</p>
<p>You also claim that a video about the sale &#8211; purchase does exist, let the evidence be brought forth and the investigating agency would be the right people to get to the bottom of the matter.</p>
<p>Ravinder Makhaik<br />
Editor<br />
My Himachal</p>
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		<title>By: Alexander</title>
		<link>http://himachal.us/2009/11/28/himachal-to-contest-london-auction-of-rare-george-cross-medal/17390/news/ravinder/comment-page-1#comment-610385</link>
		<dc:creator>Alexander</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 29 Nov 2009 00:41:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://himachal.us/?p=17390#comment-610385</guid>
		<description>The  facts are that on 28 April 2000 Brahmi Devi, the widow of Nk Kirpa Ram GC, of 8th Battalion 13th Frontier Force Rifles- (this regiment allotted to Pakistan at the time of partition) sold her husbands medals to a Kirpal Singh. (Possibly due to financial constraints).

Brahmi Devi is illiterate and cannot read or write, the affidavit was explained to her, in which she states that on her own free will she is giving the George Cross over to Kirpal Singh for services rendered, she put her right thumb impression on the document and the document was countersigned by other witnesses who were present.  The process of the transfer of the GC with Brahmi Devi present was also taped on video, and a copy of this video is  also known to exist, though it has not yet been traced. (The original affidavit is with the auction house in UK). 

It is said that Brahmi Devi is nicknamed Victorian because the villagers erroneously think that her husband had won the Victoria Cross, this no doubt enhanced her status a great deal and she accepted this erroneous title proudly, therefore it is understandable that as a matter of honour she could not bring about to tell people that she had sold her late husband’s George Cross.  As it would bring her dishonour and shame in the martial Dogra community to which she belongs.

On 26 June 2000, Kirpal Singh sold the said George Cross to a reputed coin and medal dealer in New Delhi. (A legal affidavit of this also exists and is with the auction house in UK).

It is to be noted that at that time in 2000 a George Cross (GC) had little value in the market, than what it has today. This can be gauged by the fact that a Victoria Cross in 2000 would bring circa GBP 100000, while as a GC, at that time was worth no more than GBP 3500. (At present according to the 2009 rates the GC is worth approx GBP 20000 - 25000. The Indian media has given it considerable publicity  the Chief Minister of Himachal Pradesh has taken personal interest in the matter.  The Indian Police, the  Indian Foreign Office and Indian High Commission in London are also all involved.It seems nobody is really interested in wanting to uncover the real facts, except that it has to be got back by any means!
 
The present owner of the medal, a retired army officer purchased the same from the medal dealer in mid 2000 in good faith at the then international market value  after satisfying himself that the items had been legally obtained after examining the affidavits and video, as well as by the sound reputation of the Delhi coin and medal dealer. 

He kept the medal for 9 years, and in 2009 decided to sell his entire collection of medals he had collected since the last 50 years. That is how this GC has come up for sale via the reputable DNW Auction house that has been entrusted to handle this sale.

This is not the first time a somewhat similar incident like this has happened. Lt Col M.K. Durrani another winner of the George Cross and also from a South Asian nation is a classic example where he had actually sold his medal, pocketed the money and later claimed that it had been stolen.

It may be of interest to note that Brahmi Devi lodged an FIR with the police that the medals were stolen in 2002, the fact is that the medals had been sold two years earlier, in 2000, the same year the present owner of the medals acquired them.

The DNW Medal and Coin Auction house of UK with years of experience behind them are possibly correct in saying that it is most likely a distant relative or a person with vested interests who has pressurized her into making this false statement in the hope of getting the medal back.

The best thing would be if the Himachel Government purchased the medal and presented it back to the lady giving her a decent pension to live on, so that she does not need to sell it again, it is after all a paltry sum for them - that would be the most honourable thing to do!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The  facts are that on 28 April 2000 Brahmi Devi, the widow of Nk Kirpa Ram GC, of 8th Battalion 13th Frontier Force Rifles- (this regiment allotted to Pakistan at the time of partition) sold her husbands medals to a Kirpal Singh. (Possibly due to financial constraints).</p>
<p>Brahmi Devi is illiterate and cannot read or write, the affidavit was explained to her, in which she states that on her own free will she is giving the George Cross over to Kirpal Singh for services rendered, she put her right thumb impression on the document and the document was countersigned by other witnesses who were present.  The process of the transfer of the GC with Brahmi Devi present was also taped on video, and a copy of this video is  also known to exist, though it has not yet been traced. (The original affidavit is with the auction house in UK). </p>
<p>It is said that Brahmi Devi is nicknamed Victorian because the villagers erroneously think that her husband had won the Victoria Cross, this no doubt enhanced her status a great deal and she accepted this erroneous title proudly, therefore it is understandable that as a matter of honour she could not bring about to tell people that she had sold her late husband’s George Cross.  As it would bring her dishonour and shame in the martial Dogra community to which she belongs.</p>
<p>On 26 June 2000, Kirpal Singh sold the said George Cross to a reputed coin and medal dealer in New Delhi. (A legal affidavit of this also exists and is with the auction house in UK).</p>
<p>It is to be noted that at that time in 2000 a George Cross (GC) had little value in the market, than what it has today. This can be gauged by the fact that a Victoria Cross in 2000 would bring circa GBP 100000, while as a GC, at that time was worth no more than GBP 3500. (At present according to the 2009 rates the GC is worth approx GBP 20000 &#8211; 25000. The Indian media has given it considerable publicity  the Chief Minister of Himachal Pradesh has taken personal interest in the matter.  The Indian Police, the  Indian Foreign Office and Indian High Commission in London are also all involved.It seems nobody is really interested in wanting to uncover the real facts, except that it has to be got back by any means!</p>
<p>The present owner of the medal, a retired army officer purchased the same from the medal dealer in mid 2000 in good faith at the then international market value  after satisfying himself that the items had been legally obtained after examining the affidavits and video, as well as by the sound reputation of the Delhi coin and medal dealer. </p>
<p>He kept the medal for 9 years, and in 2009 decided to sell his entire collection of medals he had collected since the last 50 years. That is how this GC has come up for sale via the reputable DNW Auction house that has been entrusted to handle this sale.</p>
<p>This is not the first time a somewhat similar incident like this has happened. Lt Col M.K. Durrani another winner of the George Cross and also from a South Asian nation is a classic example where he had actually sold his medal, pocketed the money and later claimed that it had been stolen.</p>
<p>It may be of interest to note that Brahmi Devi lodged an FIR with the police that the medals were stolen in 2002, the fact is that the medals had been sold two years earlier, in 2000, the same year the present owner of the medals acquired them.</p>
<p>The DNW Medal and Coin Auction house of UK with years of experience behind them are possibly correct in saying that it is most likely a distant relative or a person with vested interests who has pressurized her into making this false statement in the hope of getting the medal back.</p>
<p>The best thing would be if the Himachel Government purchased the medal and presented it back to the lady giving her a decent pension to live on, so that she does not need to sell it again, it is after all a paltry sum for them &#8211; that would be the most honourable thing to do!</p>
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